By Shelli Fedullo
The first time I met Harvey Hurdle was during the fall of 2018, although “met” is not really the best description. I listened and watched Harvey while he stood at the front of a conference room, presenting to and answering questions from about 15 lawyers. It was his first interview with the search committee tasked with screening candidates for the Philadelphia Bar Association executive director’s job.
It was a national search through an executive placement firm. We reviewed a lot of resumes and interviewed a good number of strong candidates. It was a competitive field. As the incoming chancellor, I would be the first to work with the new ED. This gave me no extra vote, but it is fair to say I felt I had extra skin in the game.
Harvey’s resume was impressive, but in any job interview the acid test is whether you are also good in the flesh, not only good on paper. He was. Beyond the spot-on substance of his presentation and answers, what also struck me that first time was his sincerity, authenticity, candor and energy. As the process continued, it became very clear to us and to the Board of Governors, which hired him, that Harvey would be excellent at the job. He was.
We have a running joke which Harvey started in 2020 at a quarterly Association meeting when he said a few words about my year as chancellor. I am only repeating, so blame him. He said, “You always remember your first.” As Harvey’s first (chancellor), I invited him for an unofficial “exit interview”, to look back as he retires on June 30th. Although in saying he is “retiring not vanishing”, Harvey meant something different, he got it right. Harvey’s leadership and accomplishments leave indelible marks on the Philadelphia Bar Association.
The following is an edited transcript of our conversation.
Shelli Fedullo: Harvey, thanks for joining me. Let’s call this your unofficial exit interview. Beginning in 2019 with me, you’ve worked with seven chancellors, with members of the Board of Governors, with section and committee chairs, and led the professional staff. I know the executive director’s job also has other moving parts. I’ll start with a big question. What has it been like?
Harvey Hurdle: I'll give you a few perspectives. From a business perspective, it can be challenging to maintain consistency from year to year, because the changes in volunteer leadership are not just the chancellors, but section and committee chairs as well. The Association has made great strides towards making that easier to manage by putting together a strategic plan, moving from a year-to-year change in direction to a more steady, consistent pattern. From a personal perspective, you become very close working with each chancellor, and as you have heard me joke, every year you kind of get divorced effective January 1st . What’s great is I've maintained those personal relationships. Back in the interview process, one of the questions was what I wanted the relationship to be with the leadership. I said I want to be a co-pilot, to be sitting next to someone as we’re steering the plane and figuring it all out. But while only one voice speaks on behalf of the Association, the chancellor’s, when it comes to staff and day-to-day operations, the executive director’s is the only voice. This is very important from a management perspective.
What are the moving parts? You have volunteer leadership and staff. And then what else do we have? We have 9,000 members, relationships with city officials, relationships with state officials, relationships with the leaders of the public interest community that does such incredible work for our city, relationships with sponsors that support our work, relationships with other bar associations. This is a big relationship job. It's about building and managing relationships, because the world is relationships.,
Fedullo: What has your experience and involvement been with other bar associations across the country?
Hurdle: There is an organization called the National Association of Bar Executives which provides professional development and networking opportunities for bar executives. In 2019, three months in, I was blessed with the opportunity to participate in its leadership retreat for new bar executives. Early on, I connected with leaders like David Blaner from Allegheny County and Julie Armstrong from Indianapolis and learned so much from them and others. I was not from the bar association world, so learning what others dealt with was super important. It quickly went from me learning, to me teaching about what the Philadelphia Bar Association does. I was able to be a leader in the National Association of Bar Executives, because the Philadelphia Bar Association is a leader. We do things that other bar associations don’t. Our Judicial Commission, what we do from a voter education perspective, our Delivery of Legal Services Committee, and Civil Gideon Task Force are national models. I was able to grow into leadership because I was bringing the goods to the table.
Fedullo: What are among the things you are proudest of over your time as executive director?
Hurdle: From an Association mission standpoint, there are probably three things I'm most proud of that have been incredibly impactful. The first is advancing the work of the Judicial Commission by creating a voter education outreach program. In 2015 and 2017 a total of six judges were elected to the Common Pleas Court who had not been recommended by the Judicial Commission. In 2017, the Democratic City Committee endorsed only about a third of the candidates who were Recommended by the Commission, while about two-thirds of endorsed candidates were Not Recommended. In 2019, the next judicial election year, we worked with Chatterblast to create a social media campaign to really publicize and promote the work of the Judicial Commission. We also did external media, getting interviews, editorials, op eds, to educate the public. The headline in The Legal Intelligencer after the 2019 election was “Philadelphia Bar Association Wins Primary.” We continued to build on this, and in the next judicial election year, 2021, only recommended candidates for the Court of Common Pleas won the primary. In the next two judicial election years, 2023 and 2025, all the candidates for Common Pleas Court who were endorsed by the party had also been Recommended or Highly Recommended by the Judicial Commission. That's not by accident. It’s because of the work we did by educating voters and showing we could have a true impact. Being Recommended by the Commission and having the party endorsement makes you a strong candidate, but Highly Recommended candidates who weren’t endorsed by the party have also been elected. Having the Association play this influential role in how judges are elected in Philadelphia is probably what I’m most proud of.
I'm also very proud of our work for the right to counsel for low-income tenants who face eviction without a lawyer to help them through the legal process. In 2018, before my time here, the Association retained Stout, an advisory firm, for a study, done pro bono, around the costs to the City associated with evictions in comparison to the cost of providing free legal representation to low-income tenants to help keep them in their homes. The study analyzed the overall negative economic impact on the City caused by the displacement and disruption of low-income Philadelphians as the result of eviction. It concluded that every dollar spent to fund counsel would bring $12 in cost savings to the City. We used the study to advocate, along with our public interest partners, for the City Council to pass the right to counsel legislation. The legislation passed in 2019, and starting in 2022 is being implemented in phases. As I said earlier, our Civil Gideon Task Force is a national model, and this is an example of its important work.
And finally, I'm proud of the Association for meeting the moment this year. I'm proud that we stood at a rally on May 1st with more than 450 attorneys, standing together for the Rule of Law. I am proud that our Association is part of the National Coalition, signing on to amicus briefs. I think, if not lawyers, then who? If not the Philadelphia Bar Association, then who? So, among others, these are three things I’m very proud of, the fact that we’ve changed how judges are elected, the fact that more people have legal representation in the City today, and the fact that the Association is standing up for the Rule of Law.
Fedullo: I want to circle back to the dynamics of the yearly changes in bar leadership.
Hurdle: Each chancellor was very different. From a growth perspective I'm a better person by having had to deal with seven strong personalities. The other day, as we were reminiscing, our CLE Director Tara Phoenix, said, “Harvey, it's almost like you got the right chancellor for where you were at the Bar Association almost every time.” I thought that was very perceptive. Shelli, you were my first chancellor. I remember early on you were very intentional about giving me space, saying I'm not going to hang out at the bar offices because staff needs to know that Harvey's their leader. That was exactly what was needed at the time. I saw the absolute love that someone could have for the Association and learned so much from you. It was really important to see early on how much this organization meant to its members, and you exuded that every single day.
My second chancellor was Mike Snyder, who unfortunately had the COVID year. Mike gave me a shot of optimism every day. Mike was just so optimistic in this time when it was dark. I think sometimes we already forget just how dark it was and how much we were impacted. To have a partner in Mike, who was full of optimism and was seeing the light at the end of the tunnel was so critical.
Next was Laura McKenna. I felt like our brains were often in sync from a strategic perspective. She was really focused on making sure we had a strategic plan. It took a while until we got it done, and Lauren’s the one who really pushed it forward. This was very important.
Wes Payne, the next chancellor picked it up and ran with it. I have always admired that Wes is always Wes, consistent in every single room. I also admired that if a tough conversation was ever needed on behalf of the Association, Wes did not hesitate to make it happen.
Marc Zucker was next. We could be no more different from a personality perspective and how we approach things, but we learned that we often ended up in the same place and to give each other the space to get there. I grew as a person by working with Marc, because we approached things differently, and we found a way to make it really work for the Association.
Then Jen Coatsworth. I don't know how Jen does what she does. Jen was everywhere, doing everything. I just loved the energy and enthusiasm she brought to the organization. She was always upbeat, never down. We joked that there's a clone of Jen running around. It seemed like she would be at an Association event, a family event for her kids, on a Zoom call all at the same time.
And now Kathy Jaffari. What a year to be chancellor. Kathy comes from a business background, and we had a lot of thoughts about how we were going to move the organization from a structural, bylaws perspective. We soon became consumed with defending the Rule of Law in reaction to the many new dangers to it. Our Association was one of the first to come out with a statement, and we have been a consistent advocate for protecting it. I could not be prouder of Kathy for putting herself out there again and again and being a leader.
Fedullo: Why have you decided to retire now?
Hurdle: The hardest thing about leaving this job is that I love what we do. Why am I leaving? It's the right time from a family perspective. My son Evan graduated from high school and is taking a gap year and we are going to take the opportunity to travel together to Japan and Scandinavia. We are going to spend time helping to figure out what's next for him. Spending time with Evan is super important. My mother's health has not been good. My sister has been under the burden for the last few years and l will step up. As much as I love it, the job has a lot of stress, and I joke I wouldn’t mind having a little less. My husband's an architect who runs his own business, so we're both in high stress jobs. Something my son says to me all the time is, “Why do you want to do that? I don't want jobs as stressful as yours.” What I tell him is to make sure you have a job that you love as much as I love this job. I am going to retire, not vanish and I will stay active in the city.
Fedullo: Is there anything else you want to share?
Hurdle: If you're not a member, join. The Philadelphia Bar Association is just this incredible gem for the city and for the nation with an incredible history. It has been amazing to be part of this organization, especially around what we are doing now. I think people need to really recognize that we have a gem of an organization, and it needs support. It needs support from volunteers. It needs support from dollars. And it's worth supporting.
I'm married today, and I have a kid because of lawyers and judges. I never dreamed that I'd have that opportunity, and I’m very indebted to the legal community. I'm thankful I had a chance to serve in this role. I am filled with so much gratitude to my small but mighty team. I hope they felt as supported by me as I did by them. Their commitment, work, effort and love of the Association is what makes us so successful. And thank you to all our dedicated volunteers and volunteer leadership. The time and energy you contribute is the lifeblood of the organization.
Rochelle M. Fedullo is a former chancellor of the Philadelphia Bar Association, co-editor in chief of The Philadelphia Lawyer magazine and of counsel to The Weitz Firm, LLC.
